Microsoft meets the hackers - Blue Hat "Summit"

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minas
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Microsoft meets the hackers - Blue Hat "Summit"

Post by minas » Fri Jun 17, 2005 5:06 am

Δεν θα πω πολλά, απλά διαβάστε τα αποσπάσματα που εχω παραθέσει ή/και το αρχικό κείμενο:

http://it.slashdot.org/it/05/06/16/2241 ... 72&tid=201
http://news.com.com/Microsoft+meets+the ... tag=st.num


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The demo was part of an extraordinary two days in which outsiders were invited into the heart of the Windows empire for the express purpose of exploiting flaws in Microsoft computing systems. The event, which Microsoft has not publicized, was dubbed "Blue Hat"--a reference to the widely known "Black Hat" security conference, tweaked to reflect Microsoft's corporate color.
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Within minutes after their meeting was convened, however, the hall became hushed. Hackers had successfully lured a Windows laptop onto a malicious wireless network.

"It was just silent," said Stephen Toulouse, a program manager in Microsoft's security unit. "You couldn't hear anybody breathe."
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Matt Thomlinson, whose job it is to help make Microsoft engineers create more secure code, noticed that some of the engineers were turning red, becoming obviously angry at the demo hacking incident. Yet as painful as the lesson was, he was glad to see the crowd of engineers taking things personally.
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Noel Anderson, a wireless networking engineer on Microsoft's Windows team, became suspicious as soon as he walked into the hacking demo--and saw the giant wireless antenna at the front of the auditorium.
Anderson decided that he should leave his laptop turned off, an instinct that saved him the embarrassment of falling into the hackers' trap, even though the hackers focused on a demo laptop. But under different circumstances, he thought to himself, "I might have even fallen for that."
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Yet regardless of the mutual admiration, some tense moments were inevitable during the confrontation. Microsoft developers, for instance, were visibly uncomfortable when Moore demonstrated Metasploit--a tool that system administrators can use to test the reliability of their systems to intrusion. But Metasploit also includes a fair number of exploits, as well as tools that can be used to develop new types of attacks.
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Post by AnINffected » Fri Jun 17, 2005 11:26 am

Φοβερό αυτό...
Πολύ επιμορφωτικό αλλά και ταπεινωτικό για το προσωπικό της Μ$.
The Analytical Engine has no pretensions to originate anything. It can do whatever we know how to order it to perform (...)
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Θέλω και εγώ να παίξω D&D λέμε!!! :-( :-(
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Post by HdkiLLeR » Fri Jun 17, 2005 1:39 pm

Έλα μωρέ μια χαρούλα είναι... :) :)
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Post by AnINffected » Fri Jun 17, 2005 2:36 pm

Αριστερά: Υπάλληλος της Microsoft
Δεξιά: HdkiLLeR

:smt021
The Analytical Engine has no pretensions to originate anything. It can do whatever we know how to order it to perform (...)
Ada Lovelace


Θέλω και εγώ να παίξω D&D λέμε!!! :-( :-(
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Post by mikem4600 » Fri Jun 17, 2005 6:26 pm

Αν υπάρχει, πάντως, κάποιος τρόπος το ΕΛΛΑΚ να "καταρρεύσει", μόλις τον υπέδειξε: Φάγομα απ' τα μέσα (ή "Is Linux For Losers?" αναρωτιέται το Forbes...). Το "νέο" είναι από την ίδια πηγή με τα παραπάνω... ;)
Autocracy hates questions. Anarchy hates answers.
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Post by PaP » Fri Jun 17, 2005 6:50 pm

Δεν καταρρέει το ΕΛΛΑΚ με τίποτα πλέον όλοι το υιοθετούν είτε ολοκληρωτικά είτε αποσματικά (Sun, Novell, Apple, HP ) και αυτό γιατί έχουν άμισθους developers και καλύτερο software engineeing όπως λέει η ΙΒΜ που αναδιατάσει όλο το πρόγραμμα παραγωγής κώδικα και το ονομάζει Community Source

Και επειδή το Linux θα γίνει πολύ εμπορικό τα επόμενο χρόνια και μάλλον το Mac OS X θα κατακτήσει το desktop αφού όλοι θα το θέλουν στα χ86 μηχανάκια τους και επειδή θα θέλουμε να είμαστε κάφροι θα βάλουμε *ΒSD με KDE 4.0 το οποίο θα το προσκυνάνε όλοι

Και επίσης δείτε και αυτό:

Code: Select all

O Daniel Robbins  Gentoo μαστερ παραιτήθηκε 4/2004 για να γίνει πρόσφατα σημαντική (;) μεταγραφή της MICROSOFT στο τομέα της στρατηγικής για το λειτουργικό Να συμπληρώσουμε ότι μπήκε στο τμήμα που έχει σαν στέλεχος τον Bill Hilf. Ο τελευταίος συνέβαλε στην στρατηγική της IBM για το GNU/Linux ! Μήπως ο σχεδιασμός του ICT για τα σχολεία



πρέπει να πάρει υπόψη του τις τάσεις για να μη βρεθεί να επενδύει σε πεπαλαιομένες τεχνολογίες ; δηλαδή η APPLE που έκανε την μετάβαση σε BSD UNIX (MAC OSX) , η ΙΒΜ που επενδύει τόνους $$$ σε ΕΛΑΚ , η HP κ.α θέλουν να μείνουν πίσω ; Παλαιότερα, το 1995 η MICROSOFT απέρριπτε το INTERNET (tcp/ip) . Τελικά έκανε μεταγραφή τον Christian Huitema ( tcp/ip implementor) απο το ερευνητικό κέντρο INRIA στο τμήμα Networking και προσχώρησε στο Διαδίκτυο.

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Post by minas » Fri Jun 17, 2005 9:35 pm

mikem4600 wrote:Αν υπάρχει, πάντως, κάποιος τρόπος το ΕΛΛΑΚ να "καταρρεύσει", μόλις τον υπέδειξε: Φάγομα απ' τα μέσα (ή "Is Linux For Losers?" αναρωτιέται το Forbes...). Το "νέο" είναι από την ίδια πηγή με τα παραπάνω... ;)



Το άρθρο αυτό βασίζεται σε σχόλια του Theo de Raadt ιδρυτή του OpenBSD.
Εγω μιλάω για κάποιο συγκεκριμένο γεγονός και εσύ μου μιλάς για απόψεις κάποιου. Δεν λέω ότι δεν ξέρει τι του γίνεται αλλά φαίνεται να είναι προκατειλημμένος. Πάντως ππό την στιγμή που μιλάει έτσι για το Linux φαντάζεσαι τι πιστεύει για τα Windows?

Ρίξε μια ματιά σε κάποια σχόλια που έκανε στο παρελθόν γενικά αλλά και στο τελευταίο άρθρο :
------------------------------------------------------------------
November 26, 2001
Interview: Theo de Raadt - http://kerneltrap.org/node/6

What advantages does OpenBSD offer over Linux?


Theo de Raadt:
I don't use Linux, so I do not really know how to answer this.
But when I am pressed to answer, I normally point out that our
development process is much tighter; this is perhaps a reflection of
our goals to have simpler and more proven code, and also perhaps
because of our very structured 6 month development cycle. I feel that
OpenBSD development is evolutionary instead of revolutionary, and
suspect that since our development methodology is so radically
different at a fundamental level, that it will result in many obvious
differences for the user community -- a long list full of contentious
things which I prefer not to write up.

----------------------------------------------------------------
10/09/2004 09:17:59
OpenBSD’s Theo de Raadt talks software security - http://www.computerworld.com.au/index.p ... ;16;fpid;0

Do you think Microsoft is learning from the open source community?

Unfortunately Microsoft security problems have nothing to do with Unix security problems. Microsoft’s security problems have to do with its Web client which probably has 300 to 500 vulnerabilities in it which a firewall will never block as they are all in http, all inside a TCP session and a packet filter does not help you. And when you get to some of the more obscure things like the way it does ActiveX and the way it does cookie handling and the way it does zones. These things are a continual trap for the company and all the security knowledge that is protecting us in the Unix world is useless for it. It is still going to be providing everyone with crap code, so if you’re going to keep on providing crap, then the protection technology is going to be their only saving grace, the only thing that is going to help. That’s what I think it has to do but I don’t think it is really paying attention. For example, its entire NX effort, the reliance on AMD64 PAE NX, is a mockery of what is possible because it is only protecting some parts of the address space so buffer overflows are still possible.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
06.16.05, 6:00 PM ET
Is Linux For Losers? - http://www.forbes.com/intelligentinfras ... 6theo.html

"Linux has never been about quality. There are so many parts of the system that are just these cheap little hacks, and it happens to run." As for Linus Torvalds, who created Linux and oversees development, De Raadt says, "I don't know what his focus is at all anymore, but it isn't quality."

Torvalds, via e-mail, says De Raadt is "difficult" and declined to comment further.

There's also a difference in motivation. "Linux people do what they do because they hate Microsoft. We do what we do because we love Unix," De Raadt says. The irony, however, is that while noisy Linux fanatics make a great deal out of their hatred for Microsoft (nasdaq: MSFT - news - people ), De Raadt says their beloved program is starting to look a lot like what Microsoft puts out. "They have the same rapid development cycle, which leads to crap," he says.

---------------------------------------------------------
10.09 | Sep 2002
http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/10.09/view.html?pg=3

How about the Tocqueville Institution's claim that open source software is "exceptionally risky" because attackers can reverse-engineer it more easily? Is that true?

The Institution has got it all wrong. Reverse-engineering will happen with or without source code. Sourceless debuggers for Windows code have improved a lot, so reverse-engineering has become easy. But most attackers just throw garbage at the program until it breaks, which has nothing to do with whether the source code is open or closed.
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Post by PaP » Sat Jun 18, 2005 3:29 am

Καλά αυτός ο Τεο είναι πολύ ακραίος. Τι περιμένει από κάποιον που για στο λειτουργικό του πρέπει να έχεις ειδικά προγράμματα για να πειράζεις κάποια configs και στα οποία έχεις ουσιαστικά πρόσβαση μόνο μια φόρα !

Για πες ρε Hd !!!

Σίγουρα για να έχεις OpenBSD για το primary desktop πρέπει να έχεις Μ Ε Γ Α Λ Ο πρόβλημα συμπεριφοράς και ανθρωποφοβία !
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Post by HdkiLLeR » Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:44 am

Είναι σκέτη τρέλα !! μια χαρούλα είναι μετράει και το δείχνει κιόλας.

Σχετικά με το θέμα τις ασφάλειας είναι μακράν πολύ μπροστά το άτιμο, πέρα απο τα locks τα οποία έχει σε κάθε επίπεδο στο devel δίνουν ιδιαίτερη προσοχή σε bofs κλπ.
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GCS d-->--- s+:+ a- C++(+++) BILS++++$ P--- L++++>+++++ E--- W+++ N+ o+ K w--
O M+ V-- PS++>+++ PE- Y++ PGP++ t+ 5+ X+ R* tv b++ DI- D+ G+++ e+++>++++ h r++ y++
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------

"UNIX is basically a simple operating system, but you have to be a genius to understand the simplicity." -- Dennis Ritchie
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